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Rob - banned
11-11-2005, 11:19 AM
Most Americans say they aren't impressed by the ethics and honesty of the Bush administration, already under scrutiny for its justifications for an unpopular war in Iraq and its role in the leak of a covert CIA officer's identity.

Almost six in 10 — 57% — said they do not think the Bush administration has high ethical standards and the same portion says President Bush is not honest, an AP-Ipsos poll found. Just over four in 10 say the administration has high ethical standards and that Bush is honest. Whites, Southerners and evangelicals were most likely to believe Bush is honest.

Bush, who promised in the 2000 campaign to uphold "honor and integrity" in the White House, last week ordered White House workers, from presidential advisers to low-ranking aides, to attend ethics classes.

The president gets credit from a majority for being strong and decisive, but he's also seen by an overwhelming number of people as "stubborn," a perception reinforced by his refusal to yield on issues like the Iraq war, tax cuts and support for staffers under intense pressure.

More than eight in 10, 82%, described Bush as "stubborn," with almost that many Republicans agreeing to that description. That stubborn streak has served Bush well at times, but now he is being encouraged to shake up his staff and change the direction of White House policies.

Concern about the administration's ethics has been fueled by the controversy over flawed intelligence leading up to the Iraq war and the recent indictment of Vice President Dick Cheney's top aide, I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, on charges of perjury and obstruction of justice for his role in the leak of CIA operative Valerie Plame's name.

That loss of trust complicates Bush's efforts to rebuild his standing with the public. His job approval rating remains at his all-time low in the AP-Ipsos poll of 37%.

"Honesty is a huge issue because even people who disagreed with his policies respected his integrity," said Bruce Buchanan, a political scientist from the University of Texas.

The mandatory White House lectures on ethics for its employees came after the Libby indictment, and some people say they aren't impressed.

"It's like shutting the barn door after the horse escaped," said John Morrison, a Democrat who lives near Scranton, Pa.

"This week's elections were just a preview of what's going to happen," he said, referring to Tuesday's New Jersey and Virginia gubernatorial races, both won by Democrats. "People are just fed up."

Some Republicans are nervous about the GOP's political position.

"A lot of elected Republicans are running for the hills in the Northeast," said Connecticut GOP strategist Chris DePino after what he called "a waterfall of missteps" by Republicans. Bush and the GOP must return to their message that the United States has been safe from terrorism during his administration, DePino said.

Only 42% in the new poll said they approve of Bush's handling of foreign policy and terrorism, his lowest rating yet in an area that has long been his strongest issue.

The war in Iraq is at the core of the public's unrest, polling found.

In an AP-Ipsos poll in early October, almost six in 10 disapproved of the way Bush was doing his job, and Iraq was a dominant factor.

When those who disapproved of Bush were asked in an open-ended question the top reason, they most frequently mentioned the war far ahead of the second issue, the economy.

"To use an unfortunate metaphor, Iraq is a roadside bomb in American politics," said Rich Bond, a former national Republican chairman.

Many of those who approve of Bush's job performance cited his Christian beliefs and strong values, the second biggest reason for support after backing his policies.

"I know he is a man of integrity and strong faith," said Fran Blaney, a Republican and an evangelical who lives near Hartford, Conn. "I've read that he prays every morning asking for God's guidance. He certainly is trying to do what he thinks he is supposed to do."

The poll of 1,000 adults was conducted Nov. 7-9 by Ipsos, an international polling firm, and has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-11-11-bush-poll_x.htm

sws4420
11-11-2005, 01:20 PM
The problem with a lot of these polls that get reported on is that they're worded in such a way that almost provokes the exact response that the poll-funders want to get. Also, they're notorious for polling in places that don't have an even representation of American values. For example, they'll poll a place like Manhattan and then report on how liberal the responses were. Well no shit, they polled in perhaps the most liberal city on the planet. That doesn't represent the heartbeat of American values.

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/statemapredblue.pngThe red on that map represents states that George Bush won in the 2004 election, yet they're going to sit here and claim that 60% of the country claim to disapprove of how he does his job? Bullshit.

Rob - banned
11-11-2005, 01:23 PM
Simple answer for that Bill :

Alot has changed from when everyone casted their ballot for George W. Bush from that moment till now

sws4420
11-11-2005, 01:23 PM
Such as?

Rob - banned
11-11-2005, 01:25 PM
Such as?

Need I write the book?

I'm sure even along the way those anti-Bush people that have came and gone from this Board from then till now have answered this question as time has passed.

sws4420
11-11-2005, 01:27 PM
Yes. Write a book. Only for the simple fact that I know it's going to be the same crap that has always been brought up on these boards, and hardly any of it is true.

So go ahead. My mouth is watering just thinking about it.

Rob - banned
11-11-2005, 01:32 PM
hardly any of it is true.


yeah, most american's can't be wrong.

I realize as a pro-bush supporter as you are he can do no wrong even from what has happened since he was elected and on and even as time has passed and even you, having watched story after story, coming from the newswire time after time, Doesn't it sway you in the least?

Bob
11-11-2005, 01:54 PM
I agree with Rob, doesn't it make you second guess?

sws4420
11-11-2005, 03:10 PM
yeah, most american's can't be wrong.

I realize as a pro-bush supporter as you are he can do no wrong even from what has happened since he was elected and on and even as time has passed and even you, having watched story after story, coming from the newswire time after time, Doesn't it sway you in the least?
I gave you awhile to respond to this, and this is all you come up with?

I have never said he can do no wrong, ever. Nor do I believe it. Something you don't seem to have the ability to grasp is that most news is reported for a couple different reasons. The first reason is to generate some sort of response. You of all people should understand this facet of reporting. Nobody wants to read news of things going well, people doing good, and goals being accomplished. They'd much rather be the rubber-necker on the highway looking at emergency personnel scrapnig someone's brains off the highway. I read news like you wouldn't believe, and of course I question what President Bush does at times. You should be in my office when I'm talking politics to the guys I work with. They don't allow themselves to see any of the wrong that Bush does. We had a huge discussion regarding the Harriet Miers nomination and I didn't really speak to my boss for about a week afterward. I question Bush's stance on stem cell research. I don't like that he bases some things solely on religion. But I think, for the most part, that he is doing a spectacular job with what he's been dealt while in office. His political opponents take jabs at such stuipd things like how he speaks. Who the fuck cares? If he's getting the job done, I don't give a fuck if he speaks Swahili. The 2000th soldier dead in Iraq? Arbitrary number. The 2000th is no more or less important than number 32. Or 284. It's what soldiers do. They fight for our country and sometimes they die. Show me the person that believes that all soldiers are to go to war and every single one of them is to come home. That may fly in some sort of Utopia, but not in the real world. Scooter Libby? Who gives a fuck about him? Who gives a fuck about the CIA agent that had her identity 'leaked'. How about the fact that her husband openly discussed his wife's role in the CIA at dinner functions and on the sets of news broadcasts he was a part of? Why isn't he held responsible? Or maybe the fabricated charges being brought against Tom DeLay is what you were talking about. He's been indicted for conspiracy charges. Know what is never in the news? The fact that the law he 'broke' wasn't even on the books yet when he supposedly broke it. You don't see that on the front page of any newspaper. Michael Brown of FEMA during Katrina? There's a whole section on that whole debacle elsewhere on the board. Did they fuck up down there? Yeah. A little bit. Big deal. Nothing Bush or anyone else in the world could have prevented what happened down there whatsoever. The fault of that whole ordeal lies solely and squarely on the shoulders of the local and state governmenrs that diverted their levy funds elsewhere.

Did I miss any issues since the new term began? I can talk politics all day with anyone on here, as a lot of you know that were on Rob's board during the presidential election.

Keep me posted.

sws4420
11-11-2005, 03:11 PM
I agree with Rob, doesn't it make you second guess?
Of course. But second-guessing isn't the same as losing faith in the leader of the country.